A Conversation on Ministry

Hey Loungers,

Tonight's conversation is an exclusive from Apostle Anthony Smylie Jr. and Apostle TKeyah Burnett highlighting their journey as spiritual father and spiritual daughter and navigating the dynamic of their roles and transitions. Thank you for tuning in! Make sure you like, share, and follow our page for more conversations like this!

Until All Have Heard,
- Thadd & Jas

#blackpodcasters #God #christianpodcasters #apostolic #podcast #couplespodcast #RealConversations

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:06

What's up, everybody? We're back with another episode of the Mac Lounge. And I'm your boy Fad. And I'm Taz. And today we got a special guest with us today. We are so honored to have them. We have our very own Apostle Anthony Smiley Jr. And we have our big sister Apostle Katia Brandon with us. And we're going to give them an opportunity to say a little something, and we're going to jump straight in. Amen. We're going to start with Apollo. Hello, family.

SPEAKER_01 0:36

As they said, I am Apostle Anthony Smiley. Better known as just Anthony Smiley. It is such an honor and a privilege to be here. I'm excited about what God is doing through the backwards. And I'm ready to have this conversation with them today.

SPEAKER_02 0:50

Absolutely. I am their big sister for a Apostle Tekia. Also just known as Tekia. Come from Jonesboro, Arkansas. And so excited to be here with them.

SPEAKER_03 1:02

So we are excited. It's Pentecost Sunday is over.

SPEAKER_02 1:07

Jesus.

SPEAKER_03 1:08

Is it over free? I mean, it's Pentecost Era. I thought it's Era O. We just got finished. You just finished the Bear Bones Conference. We had an amazing time in Arkansas. We were not in Jobsborough. Where were you? What were you doing? Why were you doing it? It was an amazing time. We had three discussions. And from the beginning to the end, it was just amazing.

SPEAKER_01 1:35

Big shout-out to it.

SPEAKER_02 1:41

Well, I mean, we had one of our special guests here. I was looking forward to it because of his um level of transparency. And it was just, I mean, they blew my mind. It all blew my mind. It was a great time. I don't think I'm I'm down from here between anything at all.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

I'm still up here. If I could add, I think watching Daddy is go forth uh Saturday. I think he's been in the wrong field. Yeah. Like sometimes. Yeah. Yeah. Let me just put that out there. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:18

So when you say the wrong field, what you mean?

SPEAKER_01 2:21

I mean your ability to give language to what many people are going through day to day, it is far more beyond just uh what I've known your careers to be. I believe that you have the ability to hear. I mean, even for me, I was sitting there and you were talking, I was like, that makes perfect sense. Because one of the things that he said into my mind, he said, uh he said, I have to contend with what God said and also still do the reality of the fact that I'm a macro. I'm like, that makes perfect sense. We have to sometimes think, I'm still, I'm still a smiling now, which means I still have the ability to. Yeah. So that helped me.

SPEAKER_00 3:09

That was good. Yeah. Y'all good thing. Yeah, that's good. Listen to God Betty Glow. I'm still honored that you brought me on. Uh yeah, I just want to say just a little small something about uh my lit, he is literally drenched with wisdom. He moves in wisdom. Um, I honor him so much. He has labored with me as well as my big sister. That y'all don't understand. And she moves, and she's the great example of the product of Anthony Smiley's environment. You hear me? And I'm grateful for you guys. So uh let's start there. Um, we uh we we know a little bit about you guys' story, about how y'all started and things of that nature. And he kind of explained to me in the car how he he felt. Let's start with you first. How did you feel in the beginning of the ministry? Um, for the people that are uh going through this process, let's keep them in mind that they're dealing with uh certain things that they're unfamiliar with, especially when the world says that this don't look right. How did that make you feel as a uh as a first daughter, as a first uh byproduct of Anthony Smiley ministry?

SPEAKER_02 4:25

Um, I think when I first met him, uh there was no pressure. I think I enjoyed that piece uh the most. Um he was just a normal person in his life. Um by normal, he was not normal. Let me say that. Wow. But what I mean by that is like we were in um the the college, um the college scene, and so what was my normal was not his normal. Um I could tell that he was saved, I could tell that he he lived a completely clean life. Um, but he wasn't untouchable or untraceable. Um, but he was very like personable, um, which was very different than what I had seen. I was used to seeing ministers like be out there and be too touchable. Oliver here.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

Good boy.

SPEAKER_02 5:16

Uh too, too traceable. Um, but the fact that he lived a certain lifestyle but was so loving and so warm. Um I just at first I was like, nah, it's too good to be true. Um because he was just so kind and he thought that I was so kind, I was like, he don't know for real what I really got going on. Um but his ability to uh have oversight and insight to that without judging me meant like everything.

SPEAKER_01 5:43

I was loving, I was kind. I said now, wait a minute. He looked y'all at you like I was still not.

SPEAKER_04 5:55

Thank you so much, Chasm. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02 5:58

We were talking about it.

SPEAKER_04 6:01

Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_00 6:04

So in that process, how how did that um help you grow into um I I guess say this is my spiritual father in that process? Because I know in the beginning of your process, you probably didn't you probably didn't see that because of your lifestyle or because of where y'all you guys were, how did that process look and say, hey, this is my spiritual father? And I know it's probably was past all the extra stuff and all of this stuff. So how did that process look for you?

SPEAKER_02 6:37

Um I'm definitely one of those type of people when somebody knows more than you, humble down. Like, and I think even though, because he's younger than me, not that much, but um immediately knowing like spiritually he knows a lot more than me. There was so I I didn't, I'm like, okay, humility. Um, and I always look for those opportunities. And so I think being in college, it was very weird to other people. Um, but his approach to me, as strange as it sounds, it was so positive that I did not have to like question it. Um one of the very first conversations that we had, when I was accepting the call to be a part of the ministry team, um he sent a message to me. Um, and he was like, What's your answer, daughter? And it was like immediate for me. Number one, because I had not had that like exchange with any man at all. Like I didn't even know my natural father. So to hear that, it was just too natural. It was too, I knew it was God speaking to him. And so I didn't wrestle with it. I I mean, I know a lot of people like nope, it wasn't, it wasn't hard for me to see somebody that has what you need and you go after because I know that I need something that I don't have.

SPEAKER_03 7:53

So for you, how is that for you? Because y'all went to although we know the reservation is party city. Oh my word. I knew people I went to Tugaloo, but I knew people that would go to Alcoin just to party all going. Like when homecoming came for y'all, like people were traveling from Tugaloo to go to Homecoming to go to probate. Like, so how is that for you? Because any HBCU is gonna be, I mean, it's gonna be party season. Right. So, how is that for you coming from a background that says, I'm gonna be holy, yeah, and going into an environment that you've never been into.

SPEAKER_01 8:35

I think I think what you said is very key in that. Um, growing, I think foundation, and that's in anything matters. The strength of your foundation matters. And I think because my foundation was as solid as it was, like uh I tell people, I got saved on the wings of people that were already saved 20, 30 years, they were already in ministry, they were already seasoned, and I always pick anybody that ever heard me say this, I envy uh the whole city church community because I grew up with people that you don't get to you don't get to argue with. Yeah, but they say go. You know, y'all can you can say, but I don't see it that way, and you can say, well, I don't see it that way. We just gonna agree to disagree. No, I didn't have that. I had to learn how to agree with environments that I didn't necessarily understand because they had already been saved 20 years, they had already been saved 30 years. These people were already moving in God in ways that were unimaginable. So I came in on that type of level, although it was new that I what I was birthed on that type of level. So I think the discipline and the uh the fortitude and the structure that I had was already strong enough to handle an all-core state university. So when I got out there, uh she'll tell you I would go to class. Uh we would meet for uh lunch or or dinner sometime, but for the most part, I was in at seven o'clock every night. I was in my room at seven o'clock. I didn't go back out. Uh, the only way I got out is if they said, okay, we want to run to the store, you want to ride with us? I said, okay. I said, y'all know I don't like me out. Uh, you know, not because none of it was really enticing to me, but I was able to see, wow, this is a totally different world out here. This is not what I'm used to. So I think because of how I grew up and because of uh the teachings and the foundation I received, it kind of helped prepare me for where I was going. So I think foundation matter, it played a big role in that for me.

SPEAKER_03 10:34

And I think that is key, like foundation, because I think a lot of times what happens is that we come into a situation and we don't know how strong our foundation is, yeah, or how weak it's really, because um, like I said, I went to an XBC. And while Tulu wasn't the wildest thing, it still was a place where things happen and you be in place that you shouldn't be. Um, and I don't think I had like I had a strong foundation, but I don't think I was strong enough in my foundation where I was able to be like, yeah, I'm gonna be in my room instead of instead of in the book, it wasn't starting to be able to do it. Yeah, like so when I and it was different for me, it was a shock for me because like seven o'clock on a Thursday. Oh, I heard flat irons, it's flood iron is going, it should go on, they get dressed, and I'm like, where y'all going on a Thursday? But they going on a Thursday, they going on a Friday, they going on a Saturday, you know, like they going the whole weekend is a party. And you know, I would hang out, but I wasn't trying to like, I never really went to the club, never did any of that.

SPEAKER_01 11:48

Um, just because I don't like the crowd, so you don't look like you would have did well in the club. No, you just don't look like you would have done real well. Never you didn't do no, y'all don't look like the club people.

SPEAKER_03 12:01

I would be sitting in a corner. Were you in the club?

SPEAKER_02 12:04

I was sitting there in the club, we all stayed home. Nobody get home.

SPEAKER_00 12:13

I was too claustrophobic for the club. Yeah. I like uh they my friends and stuff, they used to try to invite me even when we was in high school, and so it was a club in Memphis that it was for underage kids. I just the moment I tried to go, I just couldn't go, you know. It's just something in me that just wasn't getting me go. Like, and um then I as I got as a duck. Um the biggest thing I used to get picked on was I never went to a strip club. Me neither. I never I used to make jokes like if I go to the strip club, I'm gonna bring a bag of nickels. I'm not bringing no one.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

I've never been to that either. I've never been to any form of club. Never been to any form of club.

SPEAKER_00 13:00

And I think that's what we admire. We admire that about you. You lead by example. How it I know it ain't tough for you, but leading by example can sometimes feel uh lonely, sometimes feel, you know what I'm saying, like you're not, uh, especially at that age, like you're not, this ain't where you're supposed to be. How did that make you feel on the Alcorn States that you led by example, you had your standards, you weren't bending? Um, did it make you uh look any type of way on the campus with the people, or uh it was just a respect thing?

SPEAKER_01 13:39

I I think when pioneering can be very painful. Um and I went on campus at the at a time that the respect level for ministries was diminishing. Um it was diminishing because they were seeing the preacher at the club at them.

SPEAKER_04 13:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:00

They were sleeping with the preacher, they were smoking and drinking with the ministers. So I had to uh I when I came, I I believe with by God's grace, I offered a fresh perspective of what it meant to carry the call of God, but that still came with a lot of uh warfare because a lot of people would say that they would try to make because people they drew to me for some reason. Now, a lot of people did not, they didn't commit, they didn't, you know, they didn't go to the extent as the kid did, but a lot of people uh wanted counseling, they would want to talk, they wanted to be around, they just like to be around for whatever reason. And and and some of them, while they you know, they got a kick out of the things I was saying, I would, I would do because you know, I I would I would just say, oh no, I don't do I already do it. I said, All right now, you know that and then they start going down. I said, All right, and they would just think that was so hard, but they respected it. You know, they get to doing a lot of crazy talk. I said, All right now, you you're going too far. You get out there. We had one guy, we were out there, and uh he had started making jokes, and he was a little blessed. I said, All right, you don't play with the Lord, you're going too far. And they thought that was so funny, but he never did that again. Right. So it was that uh, you know, dealing with that, that, that, that, okay, I can be myself, and they can respect me for being myself. And even if they don't commit or they don't submit in the way that others have chosen to, I didn't have to, I didn't have to shrink who I was. And and so, and that that caused a lot of friction because there were a lot of people that that tried to make me feel bad because they would say things like, I'm anointed too. Anthony ain't uh y'all, y'all just think Anthony the only one anointed. Y'all think Anthony the only one living right. And and and that caused me to be like, okay, God, what am I doing? But these people think that I'm trying to make them feel as though they're listening, who they are, but I'm not the one sleeping around with people. I'm not the one going out. So I the battle for me was not allowing what how they felt about what I was doing and who I was to cause me to shrink in who I was. Because then when you try to do your thing and and people start making what you're doing, you know, they make it like you think you're better than them. They make you start saying, okay, let me bag up, let me, let me pipe down. You know, but I had to realize, no, I can't I can't bag up and pipe down because you had this, you know, but they you know, they they a lot of them didn't like me because they never told me this personally. Um, and I had one guy that once once we had left Allcore, he came to me, he said, and he told me, he said, the the ministers were hating on you. They said, because you were real. And and and he was free with these guys. He was like, you were real. He said, but they hated on you, and uh, you know, I'm just you know, keep doing what you're doing. I respect you. I mean, I understand everything you do, but I respect what you do because you're true to who you are. So that that was rewarding in that, but that came years down the line. But before that, them people didn't like me for some reason out there. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:13

Okay, let's let's shift a little bit. Uh, and I want to talk to Lil' A a little bit. Yeah, hey, Lil A. Lil' A, when we when you guys got to a point that where you knew you guys was gonna start a ministry, uh, you knew that this was finna take off. Um, it was there ever a point that you had to uh question where do I stand in this point? Oh, that's a good one. That's a good one, man. I love this one.

SPEAKER_02 17:43

Wow. I mean, what part what part are you thinking about? I'm thinking about um, I think COVID.

SPEAKER_01 17:51

There it is. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:54

COVID almost broke me. Um, oh my goodness, I cannot say too much, but COVID was like, at that point, we had already had on Bible study at Alcorn, we had already had the mentorship and training program, and it was the in-between, between transitioning from um him just having a mentorship and him being a pastor and like establishing and building injects. And when I tell you, I think it was the fact that number one, I was so used to it just being a small group of us. Now I had to accept the fact that there are so many more people besides me that um are is getting something from his life, um, and it's going to be developed uh by this. And so it was extremely hard. Um, I really had to confront some entitlement, some issues that I had on the inside. Um, and a lot of people would come, we call them, he used to call them puffers. People that would come around and would say, like, oh, I noticed that you're so close to him, but like I'm dying a long, hard death here. Um, and during that time, even though, and we've always been close, but during that time, it was like God was um, in a sense, like putting distance there so that I would not feel like I was entitled to the move. I had to like pray through, understand, and a lot of our interactions weren't even like in an in the natural. I'll never forget. Um there was one time we would just happen to be in the same space, and I think like I fell asleep or something, and I literally was asleep. And he said, I'm about to train you in the spirit. I'm like, what in the world? What in the world is going on here? Um, so it was just like moments like that where what you thought it was gonna be, you have to come to grips with this is not what you thought the plan was. And at that point, I hadn't even moved uprooted my life yet, but I was being challenged on every end. I had to make a decision easy. So, what did you really want to do?

SPEAKER_00 20:15

How often did you ask yourself that question?

SPEAKER_02 20:18

Oh god, no, literally, I am still asking, I think, um, in full transparency, like a week before Burry Bones, like I called him and I was like, impossible. I'm like, I don't know. I don't know, like this. I literally, I said, can I just move? He was like, You want to come home? I said, I want to come home. And I had to make sure he didn't think that I was coming out to visit. I said, I want to come home for you. I want to come back. Counsel, cut the show. Cut the tape. Yeah. Um, so I think, I mean, that's important because I used to feel like he did not understand my process. Because when I met him, he was so holy. Um, when being being a seller. Yeah. I literally die. Because he is so holy. Um, and even like him teaching us and developing us, it just seemed like he was so he is so grounded, so grounded um in all of his teachings, the teachings that he has received in his foundation. And so I just had this um I was just like, no, he can't understand. He never had a struggle. He always knew. It was just always, yes, Lord, for him. And me, I'm like, Lord, I really don't yes, kind of. Yes, sort of. Yeah. Like, yes, maybe. And so I had to, well, sometimes, right, right. Yes, Monday, but by Wednesday, like. Please. Um, I think so him, I had to get out of this um mindset that he was just perfect and everything came so easy and so humanity played that he was wrong.

unknown 22:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

And I ain't trying to hold, but this is gonna get good. This is getting oh, this is getting good. So I wanna I want to ask you, how do you feel about this? Like, because not to not but as as as the sheep, we do feel like you have the blue, we got we feel like you got it all like laid out, and sometimes uh you you're a man of mystery. We never know what you think. We don't know when you're mad us. We don't know it's that it's it's it's so uh let's let's hear your side of the story because we hear these stories about, like she said, uh he already perfect and this and that. And it and and sometimes the enemy can use that to try to flip people. Yes, he will. But what I've come to a realization is when you are firm in where you stand, when it comes down to things like that, it's gonna be tough, but at the same time, you're gonna win that battle because you done made up your mind. This is what I'm doing. I'm following this leader, I'm I'm following our spiritual leader, I'm following God. Um, and all those things have to come into place. And I'm glad you kind of brought that out because that helps a lot of people. Because a lot of people can sometimes feel like, oh, I'm just a bad person because I done went through this phase of thinking this way, and now I don't feel like I don't I don't belong anymore. That's right. But at the same time, on the same token, how do you feel? We want to hear your side of it. We want to see, we want to hear you. Wow. We're in that.

SPEAKER_01 23:58

This is rare. Uh in that. And I think I think it's very, and because I am what you all say, a man of mystery, I've I'm very misunderstood a great deal of the time. Uh, but what I try to do, especially in an environment because I don't believe our church is just comprised of members but sons and daughters. And I think it's important and intentional, and I'm very intentional about how I handle the space and opportunity that I have with each and every one of you all. Um I know for everybody's, according to who you are and what you will be, there are different versions and different sides that I give access to because I believe you don't just need to hear it, you need to see it. Um I'll I'll I it is there are sons and daughters, and there was a leader that said this that helped me, um, that helped me, but I I like sometimes I have I have certain sons and daughters in my space. I we may go out, we may just be in conversation. Uh you you may be at our home and and you may you may see you may see me and my wife in a disagreement. I think it's important to allow sons and daughters to see those areas because you'll know, okay, you'll know how you need to handle your wife, you need to know how to handle your husband, you need to know how to handle certain situations, you need to know how to handle difficulties. A couple weeks ago I came to church, I was not feeling good, but I didn't go and say, Oh, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna go because I don't want them to feel like I'm not mighty apostle. No, you need to see that I I don't feel good, but I'm still here. I think it's important to be vulnerable. Um, unfortunately, in today's society, a lot of leaders do not feel comfortable being vulnerable because their vulnerability is used against them. Uh, so it's it's a it's kind of a balance of knowing what to what to share, what to show, and what not to share, what not to show. But I think in in uh just in retrospect, I try to be as transparent as possible because people do think that I'm just perfect Peter. And I'm like, nah, we done went through some things, we done go through some things. It's just the way we go, I go through is different because of how I came up. My foundation, you know, we I I've seen, you know, I I grew up, I grew up and and and I saw um my grandmother go through some big trials and she kept showing up. She didn't she didn't show it, she didn't, she didn't reveal it. Um, she didn't, she didn't allow, she didn't wear what was worrying her. And I think I think that is what kind of separates I think me from a lot of people. It's not that I don't go through, I don't have channels, I don't have trials, but I've I understand that I still have to show up even when things show up in my life. So that's been the journey for me, uh allowing uh them, especially them as leaders at that particular time, and even on even to this day, allowing them space to see certain areas so that you'll know how to steward it when it when you come into contact with it. Um, especially with her, she you know, I she she used to always say, Oh, I got his mantle. Oh, yeah, I'm gonna be the one, I'm the one. Oh, y'all may get y'all may get the anointing, but I'm gonna get the mantle. I mean, she would just tease the people about that. And then when when when she started to see the effects associated with the mantle, she started to say, Oh, well, maybe it's enough mantle for everybody. We can check, because she saw in she saw in real time the things about associated with what came with that mantle. Um, and she would say, she said to this day, I'm literally, it's I'm just like you. I'm going through it just like I'm there. Like, yeah, that's what comes with the mantle. Uh, and and so that's what's that's the the beauty of it, I think, once you actually receive from somebody's life, if you truly receive, you ain't gotta wait to see it uh on their life, it begins to manifest in your life. And if people understood that that the marker that I'm connected to a leader is what I'm experiencing, that's the true marker. It's not old, old the anointed me be able to preach. No, it's my ability to endure hardness as a good soldier. And and and if people realize that that's the major key, is seeing that I'm able to go through hell, but hell is not consuming me, it's not overtaking me. Now, now that's how you know for real, your son and daughter. It's not how much and how close you follow, it's not how many offerings you're able to give into their life, it's are you able to handle the hell until it becomes a harvest?

SPEAKER_03 28:46

That's good, that's really good. I don't even know. Um, I do have a question. So, how does it feel to birth out a daughter? This is your like you like your firstborn. Like, so how does that feel to for you? How does it feel to let her go and do? And how does it feel for you to actually be let go and do? Because this is uh what 10 almost 10 years? So this is you've been with him for so long, like so. How does it feel to be let go for him to say no you gotta go? Like, you got to do this, and how does it feel for you to say you gotta go? How does it feel for you to say you gotta go, you gotta do this?

SPEAKER_01 29:31

Who are we gonna start with? I think for me, I think for for me, it was a a major grief, and the grief associated with it, I don't think I was able to grieve as as others may have, because we were growing rapidly at that particular time. You know, I think you all came in in that era of her transitioning. Uh, and I think the grief was this is an individual that literally embodies who I am in her own version. And to see her care, I mean, I didn't have to worry about nothing. See her carry it out, walk it out, uh, execute in the way that she did has been a very, very that you can think about hope and not think about Takia Burnett. You you that you know, she she is not just a uh a part of the history, she helped create the history for this ministry. Um, and and I always tell her she's been uh one of the greatest consistencies of my life. You know, right when people we've seen people come, we've seen people go, we've seen people come go and they still want to stick around. We've seen a compilation of different uh things. This ministry being a revolving door, and part of that has to do with um the uh apostolic mandate on this ministry, and part of it just has to do with people being fickle. So understanding that people come and go is a part of the apostolic ministry, but understanding that some people come and some people go out of season out of time, and and some people leave to be hurtful, but to understand that this individual was a consistent, that even though there are seasons and times where I feel like I need to go, I feel like I can't take no more, I feel like there's a lot, I know that's not an option. I know, I know I won't, I know I'm tired of it, but I know I I know I cannot go. Uh she has the response just like like Peter uh or John, where we gonna go? You got well that Nick, where am I where we gonna go? And I think that understanding that she had was that in the midst of everything that that we endured, that we that we faced, and we were challenged with, where am I going? So that type of revelation was hard to come by in the body of Christ. And for her to have that, and for God to say, all right, she has it, but she got to go. She has to go and do something else. Um, it was difficult, but it was not as hard because I knew she had a revelation that I don't care if you if I'm in Africa, I'm with you, I got you. I don't care if if if if wherever life takes us, I got you. Uh and and and that is a great, a great asset to any leader. So to lose that or to lose it in the way that I was used to, I should say, uh, was very difficult. She's not here every Sunday, she's not here every Wednesday. I can't call her and say, I got an idea, I want to just I just want to, you know, bounce, I just want to bounce and bounce. And and when I come with an idea, it wasn't just listening. She was gonna say, Oh, I heard that. What if you have your thought about doing it this way too? I'm like, yeah, that, oh yeah, now we we got, you know, I that was a vital uh answer to the ministry, but for that to go into a different space. And I think that's a part of leadership is learning how to grieve while growing. And sometimes growth itself is grief because this is not the same space. Um I don't do, I I kind of alluded to it on on Saturday about leadership, you know, the pressure of your past performance. You know, hey, I'm used to this, I'm used to that, I'm used to this, you know, but ultimately that that has to pass away, and we have to allow other leaders to mature and grow up. And and sometimes the pressure of that is feeling like you're having to start all the way back over, you know. But but at the but at the end of the day is okay, there's another generation of leaders that need the pressure that she carried so that they can grow into who God called them to be.

SPEAKER_02 33:56

Wow. So much. Um, I think like he brought my story uh into terms when he talked about like past performance. Oh my goodness. Um like he said, it was a very, I grieved not when I moved. I grieved when I got the revelation from God that I was gonna have to move. It was a Wednesday night, um a Bible study night, and I had already got uh offered this job, and I had already told him I'm not taking this job. I told the job, I was like, I have a church that I go to, and like I'm kind of like a major part of it, a major part of like just a little bit. So I don't think I'm I'm I'm definitely not gonna take this job. Um, and so it was like a Wednesday night, and when he said, you know, I said, Lord, I cried, I rolled on the floor, I said, no, um, I showed out. I showed out. And so after that, um moving, oh my goodness, the the part that people don't talk about is when you've been a part of something for so long, being the oldest, what it felt like was like I had to come into grips with, oh my goodness, whole city Jason doesn't need me anymore. Like, like, or they don't need they don't need this anymore. And that was so hard. Like, oh, and I used to, I used to throw off, I used to throw off about it. I used to be like, yeah, I'm finna be gone anyway. Uh I used to say stuff like, but what is my opinion matter? Like it. So it was just, it was petty, but it was like, it was me grieving, like, oh my goodness. They are about to function without me. And like, realistically, you want to see it prosper, yes. But it was all about, okay, what does that mean for my identity? So I had to relearn all over. And I think we went through, um, at some point, we both were frustrated because he was like, You should know this. And I'm like, Yeah, I should know this. This is not what I know. Like, everything is, I'm like, I get it, I get it, I get it. He was, and then at some point we kind of like had this aha moment, like, oh, you've known it as a daughter, but now have having to operate from a totally different like span where you're not a daughter in Arkansas. You a daughter, but it's like here, you're having to be, you're having to be apostolic, be an apostle here. Yeah, and it's not the same as serving in this house. And I was like, you're gonna have to help me, right? Because I don't understand anything. And I think um, it's been beautiful to grow together as hard as it has been, because I don't think people understand me being launched out was a new definition for both of us because now he's an overseer. And so we're learning, okay, what is like what does whole single art mean to you? I'm always asking. We always I'm always trying to figure out like, what do you expect from the art? What do you want from the art? But he gives me so much freedom, so I'm still in this like all right, a boss, tell me. He's like, nope, you gotta define it.

SPEAKER_03 37:13

So you went from being, and this is you went from being a daughter to a mother.

SPEAKER_02 37:21

Exactly. I did not want to say it, but there you go.

SPEAKER_03 37:24

Yeah, you went from being a daughter to being a mother, and I know how that looks in the natural, but in the spirit, that's something totally different because now you have the responsibility to birth others, yeah. And so while you've been birthed and you you understand what it means to be a daughter, to submit as a daughter, now you got other people that's gonna submit to you, yeah. And that's like something totally different. So I understand that grief.

SPEAKER_01 37:50

And I think in that, I think, I think it's not until you start assuming certain positions in life that then all of a sudden you start remembering or conjuring up all that you feel like you didn't get. Yeah. Now that you now that you're a father, now that you're a mother, I didn't have no matter do this for me. I didn't have no matter, man, you did not, you know. And and and that was one of the things she would always say, it's it'd be like it's some it's more I needed to get it. Like it was something missed, something I must have missed. No, it's not that, but you're having to see a different version of the same information you got. You have to look at it from a different from a different scope, is what I was telling the base. You have to look at it now, not from the not from the perspective you've known for 10 years, for eight years. You have to look at it now from a fresh perspective. And it's so good you you said that because what people don't realize is that even when I first when I first met you, uh, I didn't know what I was doing then.

SPEAKER_04 38:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:54

And and even and and and sometimes we we we make leadership look as though it's something that I uh already know to do, when in fact, leadership is just my ability to journey as I'm learning as well. So I'm I'm learning as I go, and as I as we go and as we grow, we learn things, and we're able as leaders to convey and communicate it. That's the only thing that makes us that makes us different. We have to remember Moses was leaving Egypt with the children of Israel. He had never done it either. So so he was the only difference, God, that was good, was that he knew how to convey and communicate what it was he was entering into. And that's the that's what separates uh that's why we need leaders, not because they know everything and they know what to do in the future, but they know how to communicate with God and convey what was being communicated to them in a way that you're able to follow it. That you know, Moses had never been in the mountaintop, you know, but he was able to communicate with a way. He had never had these experiences and experiences and these encounters with God, but he was able to take those encounters and make them and extend them to the way that others were able to understand. That's leadership in a nutshell. I'm able to walk this journey with you. I ain't been here either, but let's go. I hadn't I hadn't had to deal with this either, but let's go. You know, that that's even like being first-time parents. I don't know what it means to have to handle no twins, but let's go. We're gonna learn together. You work with me, I work with you. All right, we're gonna be good to go. Every phase of life requires leadership. And if if God have truly called an individual to be your leader, I believe that God, and I'm not talking about just mentor, I'm talking about a father and a mother. I believe that God has given them the grace and the space to help govern and grow you in every facet of your life. Not just the one, you know, that's why I don't believe that those seasons can't be up with a mother or a father. You know, you know, Jeremiah can't up and say, All right, mom and dad, y'all taught me all y'all know. Um uh it's time for me to find another mother and father. What? It ain't had that work, but now we have to, as he grows, the relationship y'all have is gonna grow. The way that you communicate is gonna grow, the way you handle him is gonna grow. Why? Because after a while, you're gonna want him to see himself as a man, and you're gonna still want him to still value all his mother. Then that's how it is spiritually as well. As you're growing, okay, I'm still your father, I'm still your leader, but the way that I lead you and the way I father you is not the same way I would father someone and lead someone that's just coming into Christ. It's a difference.

SPEAKER_00 41:33

Wow, this is exclusive. Huh? This is exclusive. It's so amazing that you just did all that because my next thing was because I know we done held y'all too long, was 60 seconds of wisdom. And you just gave it to them.

SPEAKER_01 41:48

There it was. I ain't got nothing better. I ain't got nothing better than that whole thing.

SPEAKER_00 41:53

Apostle secure. Wow. Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_04 41:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:56

60 seconds of wisdom. Whatever you want to tell the people.

SPEAKER_02 42:00

60 seconds of wisdom. Um, I would first start with uh being open. Um, I think a lot of times we put these unnecessary like restrictions. And um, if you just come in as a blank slate, and if you just say, listen, I'm just gonna assume and act like I know nothing, it makes you all the more successful um where you allow yourself to be a canvas that can be painted on. Um, because it's it's really hard to for leaders to see the potential that you have, and you already have this idea or this perception of this is how I am. And now we gotta go through the erase mark of what's already been written or sketched out. Um, on top of that, we gotta paint over it, this and the third. And so when you see or when you're going through this, you may feel like my picture has been ruined, but you don't really understand that, hey, um what it looked like it was going to become is now it's so much greater because somebody else with a different perspective has come in. So I think being open, um, being malleable um is going to be of a valuable asset. And not being afraid to die in the process, be don't be afraid to ask questions. I think what made uh our relationship both challenging but rewarding is that I was always asking questions. I'm still asking questions. I'm still asking questions. I want to know about everything. I want to know um things on the spiritual side, I want to know things on the natural side, and because of that, my life uh in in all dimensions has been um rewarding and fulfilling because my leader has been invited in every area of my life. Um so I'm so I think don't be afraid to get close, don't be afraid to ask the questions, the hard questions, and don't carry any assumptions of your leader unfairly. They don't even know you think this about them.

unknown 43:59

Um

SPEAKER_02 44:00

Anything that I've said like about him, we've already discussed, we've already talked about. Um, so that I had a healthy perception and we had a healthy relationship. And I hope that was 60 C.

SPEAKER_00 44:17

But this was amazing with you guys. I'm glad you kind of brought that out because I hear tell you, I'm asking questions. And sometimes I hesitate to ask questions because of the simple fact that I feel like I was supposed to already know. But I I ask questions. This has been a great moment with you guys. I'm very grateful for you guys.

SPEAKER_03 44:41

Thank you guys so much. Oh no, we just really appreciate y'all for coming and hanging out in the neck line. Yeah. It's just amazing to hear the wisdom from both of you guys. Um, and just telling the pieces of the journey that people don't get a chance to see. Um, the parts that don't look as polished or don't look as cute as people think it is, because of course they see where you guys are now, but they don't see the ugly parts, the parts that aren't as beautiful. Um, so it's always amazing to get that perspective.

SPEAKER_01 45:13

Absolutely. We thank y'all. Y'all make me so proud. I'm so grateful that you all are a part of the family. Uh they, you know, they are great assets to this ministry, to my life personally. And I'm just grateful that uh I'm I'm grateful for I call people like this, Priscilla and Aquila, who helped Paul uh in the ministry. And I'm grateful because you all could be uh, you all could make it difficult for each other to serve in the house of God. But I'm grateful that you all are always like, oh, there's nothing, there's no problem. That's easy. And I I'm grateful to God for y'all and I love y'all so much. Thank y'all again for this means the world to me.

SPEAKER_00 45:54

All right, everybody. That's it. And until next time, until all I've heard. Peace.

SPEAKER_03 46:02

What's up, everybody? These are your Mac Lounge announcements. Huge shout out to Hope City Jackson, where our leaders are Apostas Anthony Smiley and Lady Fairy A. Smiley. Services are Sunday beginning at 11 o'clock for Sunday school, 12 o'clock for worship service. And we also have Word Wednesday beginning at 6 30 on Wednesdays. Be on the lookout for that new location. It's coming to you guys soon. We want to also shout out Apostle Tequila. We're hosting The Art, which is in Jonesboro, Arkansas. Huge shout out to her. She has Bible study virtually every Thursday beginning at 6 30. Now moving on to Fridays. We have Faith Fuel Fridays on Friday mornings with Pastor Jasmine Moore. Um, she's going, she goes live every Friday morning at 6 a.m. You don't want to miss it. And next, moving to Apostle Tasha Myers, who has Grace, Grit, and Growth on Friday evenings beginning at 7 o'clock. You guys don't want to miss that. Grace, grit, and growth, and she also has revival of the fittest on Saturdays beginning at 3. You guys don't want to miss these events.